Native Halloween?

[loveternal (deleted)]

Are there any Native stories that could fit under the Halloween type of scariness? Or is that something that is not mentioned because of traditional rules?

[chosnazzy (deleted)]

In Lakota stories, there are some called Elk Men and Deer Women stories. They are scary and sometimes downright vicious. But they also teach very serious things, too. An Elk Man is a man who is very charismatic, and women find him irresistible.

In one story, the Elk Man walked into a village and many women, even including some married women, immediately ran to him. Each woman wanted him to take her as his woman. However, older and wiser women know about him. And so even though they warned their younger female relatives that the he is not such a good thing to have, the other women still want him even more.

Eventually he chose a woman and she took him to her tipi for the night. On other evenings, sometimes it was a married woman who took him somewhere outside the camp to have S-- with him. To him, it did not matter if the woman was married or not.

Husbands of these women tried to kill him. But the following day, he still returned to this village, as if nothing happened. No medicine or Holy person could defeat him. And so the people were virtually at the mercy of the Elk Man. And he continued having his way with the women, as they also wanted him.

Then one day, he chose a woman to marry. And the village was relieved. After the marriage ceremony, he said he would take his new wife to meet his family. And she was elated because now he was all hers.

Several days had passed on their journey to his home, and they came to a wide river. And he told her to climb on his back and he would carry her over like that. So she did. By the time they were near middle of the river, they were very wet. And she saw something moving under his hair at the back of his head.

When she looked closer, she noticed that it was an eye that was blinking at her. When she parted the hair, she noticed there was a second horrendously looking face on the back of his head.

At first she was incredibly scared. But then she smelled his skin and it smelled like lavender. She looked away from the second face, thinking to herself that everything was good, as she reminisced about the S-- they had days earlier.

Finally, they made it to the other side, and they rested for a while, and they had s--. She tried to force out the visual of his second face by focusing on the S-- they were having at that moment.

After resting a little more, they continued their journey to his home. Soon she could smell smoke and she saw a tipi in the near distance. He said they were almost home now, and his mother was preparing a feast for them.

When they arrived at the tipi, she noticed there were bones lying on the ground all around his tipi. She thought to herself that he must be a really good hunter because all these bones looked as if they had been of many things that were killed very recently.

She knew they were human bones, but she was trying to force herself to think that they were really discarded animal bones that landed in such a way that they only looked like they were human.

When they went inside the tipi, his mother greeted her very affectionately, marveling at her new daughter-in-law's skin and how nice if felt. And then the Elk Man said he was going out to gather some wild turnips to add to the soup that they were going to eat that evening. He told his wife to stay and get to know his mother.

The new wife suddenly felt strange because in Lakota tradition, you are not to talk to your parents-in-law, as a sign of respect. The new wife was looking around the tipi and she saw something that looked like leather but it had a strange color. When she touched it, it felt really weird. And then she noticed that one piece looked like a human face, and then she realized this was dried human skin. Now, she could not rationalize this experience away anymore.

Immediately, she got up and ran away. But the Elk Man caught her and brought her back and tied her to the ground inside the tipi. He spread her legs apart and tied her arms and legs to different tipi poles. And he also spread her hair apart and tied the strands to some tipi poles. Then he went outside to get the wild turnips. The mother-in-law said she was going outside to gather more wood for the fire.

Soon afterwards, two beavers came inside the tipi and gnawed away the leather tongs that were used to tie her down. And she followed them outside. Then, they all ran to the river, and this day the water was flowing incredibly fast. One beaver took some tree branches and rocks and began making a damn. And then she walked behind him.

The second beaver was walking behind her and taking the damn apart and giving the tree branches and rocks back to the first beaver walking up front. And this is how they made a moving damn, that enabled them to cross the river.

When they were half way across the river, the Elk Man discovered his wife had escaped, and he was trying to cross the river but it was moving too fast and his foot got caught on something at the bottom of the river, so he became trapped underwater.

The beavers were able to get her across the river safely and they escorted her home. When she came walking back into the camp, everyone was happy to see her because she survived an Elk Man experience.

The End..... or was it?

[chosnazzy (deleted)]

There are a lot of Elk Man stories like that. And they all teach things concerning love and sometimes s----lity. And they also teach about what can happen when you only focus on the physical drive or emotions only, while entirely leaving out the mind or at least not using the mind in a rational way.

[loveternal (deleted)]

WOW! That should be a movie! I love it! And you can pick up some of the things to be learned, like taking the time to know someone by going beyond the physical attraction. Just because someone is physically beautiful does not mean their way of thinking is beautiful. And another thing that can be learned from that story is that even when you make a bad decision, you can still learn from it and be ready for unexpected help to arrive. Then the experience becomes a powerful teaching experience and not a mistake or failure.

[chosnazzy (deleted)]

`And then there are the Deer Woman stories. A lot of different tribes have these stories. Usually they have the same themes, but there are variations from tribe to tribe.

In the Lakota way, Deer Women are blacktail deer that can read a man's mind and then transform themselves into either the woman the man is thinking about or the man's fantasy woman. Then they follow the man until he is alone and away from the village. And then they appear naked in front of him and lure him further away into an area where there are a lot of trees. And as they are having sex, suddenly she will turn back into the blacktail deer and start kicking him in the groin "area". If he escapes, he becomes mentally disturbed. Oftentimes, he will have to go through an Inipi ceremony to get the unhealthy energy from that experience out of his body. And even if they get out all the bad medicine, he is never the same. He is no longer a good hunter and he loses confidence in everything he does.

If you go to any Lakota, Dakota or Nakoda rez, just about every family has a deer woman story that happened to some man in their family. Sometimes the stories even happened in the present day.

When I still lived on the rez in America, one of my students on the Cheyenne River Sioux Reservation in South Dakota told me a really good one from his family. He said that his uncle was a school bus driver and everyday after school, he would drop off all the students who lived out of town. Well, on one Autumn day, he was finished dropping off all the students and he was driving back alone to the town.

The sun had just set and suddenly out of the blue, he saw this woman hitch-hiking up ahead. As he approached her, he slowed the bus down and offered the woman a ride into town. He told her to get inside because it was going to be dark soon. She just stood there looking straight ahead. He asked her who she was because he did not recognize her, and also she was wearing a really long dress, which is really odd because no one on the rez dresses like that anymore.

Everytime he asked her something, she would not respond. Instead, she looked straight ahead. And then he looked towards her feet but he could not see anything. Immediately, he slammed the door shut as fast as he could. And while he was putting the bus in gear to drive away, she began to kick at the door.

When he looked toward the door, her upper body was perfectly still and she was looking towards him but she seemed to be looking right through him. Her arms were motionless and at the side of her body. But her legs were really moving fast, kicking at the door. His suspicions were correct.

As he drove away, the woman began to run right along with the bus. The faster he drove the bus, the faster she ran. She was running beside the bus the whole time. Her upper body was perfectly still, and her head was turned looking inside the bus. He did not want to make eye contact so he started to sing Sun Dance songs and was driving as fast as possible. The whole time, she was running right alongside the bus! The faster he drove, the faster she ran to stay right beside the door of the bus!

As he approached the town, she ran off to the side of the rode and jumped over a barbed wire fence like nothing. And even when she jumped over the fence, her upper body was perfectly still with her arms also still motionless at the side of her body, while her legs were moving incredibly fast. She ran into a wooded area and the next moment he saw a black tail deer running on the opposite of that area.

He drove the bus straight to the local medicine man's house and was all out of breath. He could not speak and was shaking fiercely. The medicine man knew instantly that this guy saw a Deer Woman. So he got some men together and immediately started an Inipi ceremony to get that bad medicine out of that man's body.

They were successful and after that this guy decided to find a different job.

That is just one example of a modern day Deer Woman story, and there are a lot of Deer Woman stories like that. And many times, the men are not as smart as this bus driver, and they end up becoming worse victims.

That's the kind of thing that can happen to a man when he puts his brain is in the wrong place :)

[loveternal (deleted)]

`WOW! These stories are really exciting and scary at the same time. I think they teach what happens when you focus only on the physical aspect of everything. Your spirituality will become weak. You start to focus on certain emotions to keep that focus on the physical aspect. And then you lose your mind. That's my first impression. The stories show what happens when you become unhealthy emotionally. I like it that these stories really have a lasting effect. All day today, I was thinking about the Elk Man story you wrote about the other day. Many guys are like that. On here, I get asked a lot from guys to send them photos. I just ignore them all. To respond to them is just not worth my time. They are like Elk Men in a way. This is why I think friendship is more important because it gives an emotionally healthy foundation to build upon. :)

[chosnazzy (deleted)]

`That's how I see it, as well. When a girl thinks she has to show off her body parts in her profile to get attention, it is only showing what kind of person she is inside herself. So most likely she will attract losers. The way a person dresses and shows themselves in public is a reflection of the level of their self-esteem and self-worth, as well as their level of emotional security and insecurity. When a person displays themselves in a respectful way, that shows they respect themselves, as well. And a good guy knows that for anything worthwhile to happen, it has to have a healthy foundation to grow upon, as you state in your own profile. So the good, strong healthy relationships are the ones that start as friendship, in which they know how each other thinks about things. And good guys know how to recognize when a woman respects herself, as he respects himself, too.

So you can see how these Elk Men and Deer Women stories are still applicable to today's world.

This is why I shy away from profiles where girls are showing all their legs and cleavage and such :)

[lily4567 (deleted)]

`Once again dear Chosnazzy speak of your problem with me please

[chosnazzy (deleted)]

`Pardon moi, dearest lily4567. What problem are you talking about? Vous me demandez pourquoi Je t'aime trop fort? Do you think that is Halloween scary? Geez!

:)

[lily4567 (deleted)]

`Yes Halloween is very scary ! it's true !!!
And seems it you have tell to me why I love you very much also?

[chosnazzy (deleted)]

`But thats a "Happy Happy scary" not a Halloweenie scary

[lily4567 (deleted)]

lily4567 wrote: `Yes Halloween is very scary ! it's true !!!
And seems it you have tell to me why I love you very much also?

[chosnazzy (deleted)]

I have to tell you why you love me very much? That would take all day to do because I am sure you have over a million reasons why you love me!

Or do you want me to tell you why I love you so much? If this is the question, that would take forever because my love for you has no end. But that is not a problem, ok?

[chosnazzy (deleted)]

`But let me tell another story first, ok Lily?

This story also has some characteristics that could fit under a Halloween style theme.

In Lakota culture, there are a series of stories about a man named Iron Hawk. And these stories were usually told to young boys before they reached puberty. These stories concern the development of a man.

In one scene, Iron Hawk is a young man and he is traveling around Lakota country seeing all the land and meeting people. When people need help, he helps them willingly, as he is a very friendly man. And his hope is to also find a woman that will marry him.

One day in his travels, he saw someone in the distance lying on the ground. At first he thought maybe that person was sick and needed help so he ran over to that person as fast as he could. As he got closer, he saw that it was a woman. And as gets even closer, he noticed that she was completely naked and her legs were spread wide apart. And she was asking him to have S-- with her.

This woman was incredibly beautiful and her voice was very enticing. And he seemed to lose control of himself, as he was captivated by her beauty. So he took off his clothes and began to have S-- with her. As they were doing it, she was scratching his back, as if she was trying to cut him but she was unable to do so. And she was surprised that she could not cut his back open.

After they were done, they put their clothes back on and she asked him to come back to her tipi. She knew he was traveling a long distance and that he must be really tired. She said he could rest at her tipi for a time, and that she would be happy to feed him. So he agreed and they went back to her tipi.

As they were walking, she told him that she was looking for food and that she saw him in the distance. She said that she was tired and laid on the ground to rest. When she realized it was him she became attracted to him and she wanted to make sure that he saw her, that is why she laid on the ground naked.

She talked most of the way as they were traveling to her tipi. And before he could ask her anything, they had arrived. They went inside and he noticed there was a small boy tied to one of the tipi poles. She said that was her son and that he was always getting into trouble. And she did not want anything bad to happen to him, as she was out hunting so this is why she had to tie him down.

Iron Hawk noticed the boy's clothes were tattered and that he was incredibly skinny. He looked like a skeleton with skin over it, and his body was very dirty like he never took a bath in a very long time. The woman said that every time she tried to feed him, the boy would spit out the food and she did not know how to make him eat. She told Iron Hawk to lay down on her buffalo robe and rest. Then she said she was going outside to find some wood to make a fire and that she would make them a soup for dinner that night.

So Iron Hawk agreed and laid down for awhile. Then she went outside. Before Iron Hawk fell asleep, the boy asked him to help him. So Iron Hawk sat up and asked the boy what was wrong. The boy said that the woman was not really his mother. He said this woman killed his father and then killed his mother. And then she forced him to come with her. She told the boy that she intended to fatten him up because she said little fat boys were very tasty to eat. This is why he never ate the food she gave to him.

He also told Iron Hawk that she goes out to kill men. He said he does not know how she does it, but that she comes home sometimes with pieces of meat that do not look like it was from an animal. And this meat has a strange smell but not an animal smell. And that is the other reason why he did not want to eat it when she tried to force him to eat it. He said the meat tastes weird so he spits out immediately. Then she really gets mad and beats him. Then he showed Iron Hawk his recent bruises.

Iron Hawk could feel the truth in the boy's words. So immediately he stood up and untied the ropes from the boys arms and legs. The boy could barely walk so Iron Hawk carried him outside. And he said they would follow the woman to see what she does. So Iron Hawk followed her foot tracks, and then he was suddenly surprised to see that her foot tracks turned into mountain lion tracks.

Now Iron Hawk was really concerned about this woman. So he ran faster with the boy to catch up to the woman. And soon they were close to her, and they saw that she was laying on the ground, just like how he saw her earlier that day. And he saw in the distance that a man was walking towards her. And the woman was again naked with her legs spread apart. Iron Hawk was trying to warn the man to stop, but he was too far away.

Iron Hawk, with the boy, ran as fast as he could towards the woman. However, the other man got there first and began to have S-- with the woman. Iron Hawk noticed that the woman began to scratch this other man's back furiously. The other man screamed in agony, as she began to tear his skin off from his body. She had skinned him alive while he was having S-- with her!!

She began to tear the man's flesh from his body, and then Iron Hawk took out his bow and shot an arrow that went right through her heart and she dropped to the ground. Then Iron Hawk and the boy ran to her, and as they approached her body, they saw that she was a mountain lion.

Iron Hawk told the boy to come with him to his grandparents home. When they arrived the grandparents were really happy to see this little boy. And they agree to raise him as their grandson. And the grandparents named the boy "Red Hawk".

And that is one story of the scary "Mountain Lion Woman".

Again, these kind of stories focus on what can happen when you focus only on S-- and physical attraction, and nothing else. That you will be victim of your own selfishness in the end. It is scary and could be a Halloween style movie!

[chosnazzy (deleted)]

These Iron Hawk stories are really cool because they teach other things, too, that are really nice. For example, one of the stories teaches about the usage of the Four Times concept. It is something where when you are asking for something special, you may have to ask for it four times. This four times concept is really present in many Lakota ceremonies. It is when you ask for something, and the answer is no. But you ask a second time, and again the answer is no. So you ask for it the third time, and still again the answer is no. So you pause for a time and really think about what it is you are asking for. Then you ask a fourth time, and most times the answer will be yes. If the answer is still no, you just have to ask the question differently, which means you have to think about it more. In the Iron Hawk stories, this is done in a really silly way, but that's more of a comedy story